From w5xz at att.net Mon Apr 25 12:42:21 2011 From: w5xz at att.net (dan edwards) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2011 09:42:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions] trouble shooting a 4 square Message-ID: <636744.83010.qm@web180209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Lee / Dick: a modest proposal for newbies: troubleshooting a hiZ 4 square: After using this in a 'hostile' ?( house in middle, power lines, Tx ant way to close )?environment for a couple of years, i can offer a tip or 2, beyond seeing LED lit,?and measuring about 4.5 vdc across the antenna terminals. sometimes, " it just doesnt seem to be working..." 1. it only takes ONE loose wire, antenna, ground, or coax shield to mess mine up.check them?all. i use a micro dab of anti-seize on everything in Texas heat and?humidity. seems to help. at the antennas and at the controller. I have even tinnedthe center conductor of the RG-6 with some silver-added solder. previously, RUST?was visible inside the male F-connectors. I finally found some solid copper centerconductor RG-6....which seems a bit better 2. check WWV on 2.5 Mhz. If you're not seeing a pretty nice pattern off sides?and back on WWV, something is wrong. Also, top end of Broadcast Band AM?I can often hear FOUR different stations on the same frequency...down to about?1000 khz or so.. lower, the spacing is probably too small..my spacing is 90??ft - for easier mowing, mostly.... 3. ( tip from Lee ) disconnect both 'short' and 'long' delay lines. now, the controllerjust points to ONE antenna at a time. If you have the handy-dandly battery poweredsignal generator ( 1840 khz or so ), each antenna should should the same S-meterreading in the shack, as you walk it around to each element and switch the controller.?If you have a strong,?steady BCB station above 1500 khz, they should also give very?similar S-meter?readings on all 4 antennas....DONT FORGET TO HOOK IT BACK UP (dont ask?me how i know...) when you are done ( the delay lines ). ? This can point?you to?a bad preamp or ?bad feedlijne.....?4. sometimes, 160m is just 'strange'..........maybe that's why we like it ?? 73, W5XZ, Dan From contact at hizantennas.com Mon Apr 25 13:48:30 2011 From: contact at hizantennas.com (contact) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2011 10:48:30 -0700 Subject: [Hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions] trouble shooting a 4 square In-Reply-To: <636744.83010.qm@web180209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <636744.83010.qm@web180209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4DB5B3EE.7080105@hizantennas.com> Dan-san, Well stated.. Thanks. Dick On 4/25/2011 9:42 AM, dan edwards wrote: > Lee / Dick: a modest proposal for newbies: > troubleshooting a hiZ 4 square: > After using this in a 'hostile' ( house in middle, power lines, Tx ant way to close ) environment for a couple of years, i can offer a tip or 2, beyond seeing LED lit, and measuring about 4.5 vdc across the antenna terminals. > sometimes, " it just doesnt seem to be working..." > 1. it only takes ONE loose wire, antenna, ground, or coax shield to mess mine up.check them all. i use a micro dab of anti-seize on everything in Texas heat and humidity. seems to help. at the antennas and at the controller. I have even tinnedthe center conductor of the RG-6 with some silver-added solder. previously, RUST was visible inside the male F-connectors. I finally found some solid copper centerconductor RG-6....which seems a bit better > 2. check WWV on 2.5 Mhz. If you're not seeing a pretty nice pattern off sides and back on WWV, something is wrong. Also, top end of Broadcast Band AM I can often hear FOUR different stations on the same frequency...down to about 1000 khz or so.. lower, the spacing is probably too small..my spacing is 90 ft - for easier mowing, mostly.... > 3. ( tip from Lee ) disconnect both 'short' and 'long' delay lines. now, the controllerjust points to ONE antenna at a time. If you have the handy-dandly battery poweredsignal generator ( 1840 khz or so ), each antenna should should the same S-meterreading in the shack, as you walk it around to each element and switch the controller. If you have a strong, steady BCB station above 1500 khz, they should also give very similar S-meter readings on all 4 antennas....DONT FORGET TO HOOK IT BACK UP (dont ask me how i know...) when you are done ( the delay lines ). This can point you to a bad preamp or bad feedlijne..... 4. sometimes, 160m is just 'strange'..........maybe that's why we like it ?? > 73, W5XZ, Dan > _______________________________________________ > Hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions mailing list > Hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions at hizantennas.com > http://mail.hizantennas.com/mailman/listinfo/hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions_hizantennas.com > From n1rj at roadrunner.com Mon Apr 25 14:50:05 2011 From: n1rj at roadrunner.com (Roger D Johnson) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2011 14:50:05 -0400 Subject: [Hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions] trouble shooting a 4 square In-Reply-To: <4DB5B3EE.7080105@hizantennas.com> References: <636744.83010.qm@web180209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4DB5B3EE.7080105@hizantennas.com> Message-ID: <4DB5C25D.6060803@roadrunner.com> On 4/25/2011 1:48 PM, contact wrote: > Dan-san, > > Well stated.. Thanks. > > Dick > > On 4/25/2011 9:42 AM, dan edwards wrote: >> L >> 3. ( tip from Lee ) disconnect both 'short' and 'long' delay lines. now, the >> controllerjust points to ONE antenna at a time. If you have the handy-dandly >> battery poweredsignal generator ( 1840 khz or so ), each antenna should >> should the same S-meterreading in the shack, as you walk it around to each >> element and switch the controller. If you have a strong, steady BCB station >> above 1500 khz, they should also give very similar S-meter readings on all 4 >> antennas....DONT FORGET TO HOOK IT BACK UP (dont ask me how i know...) when >> you are done ( the delay lines ). This can point you to a bad preamp or >> bad feedlijne..... 4. sometimes, 160m is just 'strange'..........maybe that's >> why we like it ?? >> 73, W5XZ, Dan >> _______________________________________________ > Does this apply to the 8 circle array also? 73, Roger From n1rj at roadrunner.com Mon Apr 25 14:54:33 2011 From: n1rj at roadrunner.com (Roger D Johnson) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2011 14:54:33 -0400 Subject: [Hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions] trouble shooting a 4 square In-Reply-To: <4DB5B3EE.7080105@hizantennas.com> References: <636744.83010.qm@web180209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4DB5B3EE.7080105@hizantennas.com> Message-ID: <4DB5C369.9050109@roadrunner.com> On 4/25/2011 1:48 PM, contact wrote: > Dan-san, > > Well stated.. Thanks. > > Dick > > On 4/25/2011 9:42 AM, dan edwards wrote: >> L >> 3. ( tip from Lee ) disconnect both 'short' and 'long' delay lines. now, the >> controllerjust points to ONE antenna at a time. If you have the handy-dandly >> battery poweredsignal generator ( 1840 khz or so ), each antenna should >> should the same S-meterreading in the shack, as you walk it around to each >> element and switch the controller. If you have a strong, steady BCB station >> above 1500 khz, they should also give very similar S-meter readings on all 4 >> antennas....DONT FORGET TO HOOK IT BACK UP (dont ask me how i know...) when >> you are done ( the delay lines ). This can point you to a bad preamp or >> bad feedlijne..... 4. sometimes, 160m is just 'strange'..........maybe that's >> why we like it ?? >> 73, W5XZ, Dan >> _______________________________________________ > Does this apply to the 8 circle array also? 73, Roger It appears to me that with no delay lines, as you switch around, you would connect to "pairs" of elements. Still a good troubleshooting tool though. 73, Roger From k7tjr at msn.com Fri Apr 29 11:02:48 2011 From: k7tjr at msn.com (Lee K7TJR) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2011 08:02:48 -0700 Subject: [Hi-zreceivingarraydiscussions] New App note Message-ID: A new application note destined for the website soon. Lee Antenna Inputs With Voltage - Caution All of the Hi-Z Array systems use voltage over coax to supply operating power for their Hi-Z amps. The power is injected into the Antenna connectors on the controllers using normal inductors suitable for the purpose. It is certainly possible to damage these internal inductors if an intentional or unintentional shorted circuit is applied to any of the array contollers antenna input connectors. This causes a large DC current to flow in the inductors and depending on the current rating of the system power supply used will most certainly cause damage to those internal inductors used to inject the DC voltage. An unfortunate result of the application of a short circuit to the antenna connectors is an invisible damage to the inductors. Surprising or not, they lose some or all of their inductance which then shunts incoming signals to ground causing the array to not work to its full potential. The most noticeable thing caused by this is the loss of front to back ratio. Secondly pattern distortion resulting in excess received noise. This makes it ultra important to check all cables used in the system for any defects in assembly before connecting them to the controller. It is most useful to both physically inspect the inside of the F connectors and electrically test them with an Ohmeter between the center conductor and the outer shield. There should be well above 100Kohm impedances tested on all open cables. Whenever working with the antenna inputs, one should simply disconnect the power link provided on the controllers from the "Coax Power In" terminal. This removes the DC power supplied to these inductor injection circuits removing the possibility of damage. One easy test to make if you suspect any damage to the controller is to apply a test signal directly into the array. This can easily be done with the Hi-Z Signal Source. Using the High mode on the signal source connected directly to each field installed antenna you should see the same signal level for each antenna when measured at the receiver. Any antenna with a low signal then should be retested by removing the "Coax Power In" link on the controller and applying the Signal Source directly into the controller antenna inputs using the LOW mode. All controller Antenna inputs should read the same level at the receiver Except for the Triangle array. The triangle array has a built in signal imbalance of 6 dB or 0.5. Contact Hi-Z if you need more assistance or repairs to a damaged unit. contact at hizantennas.com